"When one speaks one's truth with utter sincerity, even the gods must listen,
- Thread starter Daniel~
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Here's what i see. A very young person who understands what very old people don't seem to, She's fighting for her life.
Thi s one point where Dr Peterson and I don't see eye to eye.
I posted his discussion concerning this.
I listened all the way through waiting to hear, what I never heard.
If what he says is true Why the **** is the entire world seeing extremums freezing then frying?
Then there's the ungetoverable problem of vanishing resources.
I keep hearing that science will solve these problems...Then why the ****
Are we going under faster today than we were yesturday? And we are speeding up on the way down.
Look at our resource verses population expansion. More and more will have less and less.
The thing about Greta for me is this. She started this and remained alone in her vidgual for almost a year she met with no response Barely even a teen.r. Sitting in the cold out side of her school all day every Friday.
9 months before a single student joined her.
She's autistic. Think on that. Someone Whose supposed to be lacking is social graces. Some one already set apart and most often alone.
Isolated by her very condition. Yet she sat alone with a truth she could not turn away from.
And this is who steps out of her childhood security to face a very hostile world with a very unwelcome message.
The speech she brutalize congress with was the purest form of outraged innocence I have ever in 72 years seen..
I confess that I very much respect and admire Dr Peterson.
Never the less I cling to something I have always believed
"Out of the mouth of babes comes the truth."
In the I-Ching it is said that in times of great change and turmoil
it is not the sage who can console even the wise that gets the time right
but the young who are said to score a bullseye for it is the time itself that calls fourth the young into action.
I see Greta as a harbinger of change.
I don't often try and predict what's next. Mostly because I suck at it.
So for what it is worth. If we do not heed her if we find reasons to dismiss her and her message.
All that she and her generation fear will come to pass.
When Vesuvius blew Pompeii had tons, weeks and weeks of warning quake and belching smoke. But only a few fled, mostly the young who had nothing much to lose by going.
Why. Because the "Wise Heads" assured the people that there was nothing to fear. As wise heads feared nothing more than a loss of profits.
When Mount St Helen blew we had lots of warning But Governor Ray Her self a physicist Refused to issue an order to evacuate or close highways into that area as she fear it would be unpopular, I.E. bad for her to do so.
Vested interests are always in play. We seldom do the right thing mostly preferring the easy and expedient.
Greta like myself despises the empty promise that may well doom her.
I see Peterson as a brilliant and compassionate man,well suited to uncovering intrigues and dishonestly in our social discourse.
Greta is not dishonest. I fear Greta Has the time right and has scored a bullseye as far as knowing the time.
Perhaps he does elsewhere , But Dr Peterson did not on that occasion of which I posted ever say "This is really what's going on."
And I feel he needs to, because beyond all doubt something very troubling IS going on!!
How can anyone not like Greta ? Such fierce eyes and courage as she stood before congress and gave them hell in the name of her truth.
She speaks her truth even to power and they cringe before.her and repeat their lies.
MAN!
not since Jone of Arc....
I'm hesitant to weigh in on such a highly charged subject, but, well, caution to the wind I guess....
I have no doubt of Gretta's sincerity, nor do I generally have any reason to doubt the sincerity of the folks (both young and old) for whom this issue is a concern. Let me rephrase that; for whom this issue is an ACTIVE concern, since it is a concern for all of us, it's just some of us don't realize that yet.
Having said that, however, standing in the middle of a room yelling "Fire!" doesn't help a lot. Driving solutions actually works towards a goal. So far, all I've heard is Gretta castigating the leaders, and don't get me wrong; from a purely emotional perspective, seeing the politicians getting yelled at is viscerally satisfying, but that's not solving anything.
Asking pointed questions such as "Why aren't we doing x?" is much more productive. It leads to conversations, which spawn ideas, which become solutions.
www.theoceancleanup.com is an example of a young person who saw a problem, was dissatisfied with the response, and made an effort to create a solution.
And yes, as much as science is what got us into this mess, it is also going to be science that gets us out of it.
Or did you think that solar panels and wind farms just sprouted in fields as long as there was water and sunlight?
I have no doubt of Gretta's sincerity, nor do I generally have any reason to doubt the sincerity of the folks (both young and old) for whom this issue is a concern. Let me rephrase that; for whom this issue is an ACTIVE concern, since it is a concern for all of us, it's just some of us don't realize that yet.
Having said that, however, standing in the middle of a room yelling "Fire!" doesn't help a lot. Driving solutions actually works towards a goal. So far, all I've heard is Gretta castigating the leaders, and don't get me wrong; from a purely emotional perspective, seeing the politicians getting yelled at is viscerally satisfying, but that's not solving anything.
Asking pointed questions such as "Why aren't we doing x?" is much more productive. It leads to conversations, which spawn ideas, which become solutions.
www.theoceancleanup.com is an example of a young person who saw a problem, was dissatisfied with the response, and made an effort to create a solution.
And yes, as much as science is what got us into this mess, it is also going to be science that gets us out of it.
Or did you think that solar panels and wind farms just sprouted in fields as long as there was water and sunlight?
I hear you Chris.
In my view its really a matter of time.
Once we are ablaze We must be awaken and aroused to fight the fire, AS Greta herself told congress "I shouldn't even be her,e I should be in School "
Make no mistake Greta has awaken millions.
paraphrased:
When a mountain spring first bursts forth it dose not know where it will go or how it will get there.
Yet it only needs to follow it's own nature to contribute to the life of rivers and lakes.
Greta is a voice crying in the wilderness
she is not a scientist, she has no degrees, no credentials. As far as I know she hasn't put forth any specific plan.
But every where she looks the planets dying. The oceans are becoming ever more polluted and empty of fish.
So she turns to us, the adults and asks "What will be left for me and my children?
And face this if you wish to know Greta
WE have NO answer for her, we just chatter on like monkeys and maybe this makes her just a little crazy.
If so I would call that a divine madness
To think that this corrupt old world would ever listen to a child.
Well she has this going for her.
It is written that those who cannot be made to listen
must/will be made to feel."
Children grow up. The richest of men grow old.
Trust me Greta has yet come into her time When she does she will have an entire generation at her back.
"Beware when a man takes three steps back
he mat be preparing to make a great leap forward"
Greta is laying the foundations of all that is to come, of all that must come if Greta and her children are to survive.
And to be brutally honest here.
WE have no rights what so ever
We are rapists complaining that our victim is telling everyone of our crimes.
In my view its really a matter of time.
Once we are ablaze We must be awaken and aroused to fight the fire, AS Greta herself told congress "I shouldn't even be her,e I should be in School "
Make no mistake Greta has awaken millions.
paraphrased:
When a mountain spring first bursts forth it dose not know where it will go or how it will get there.
Yet it only needs to follow it's own nature to contribute to the life of rivers and lakes.
Greta is a voice crying in the wilderness
she is not a scientist, she has no degrees, no credentials. As far as I know she hasn't put forth any specific plan.
But every where she looks the planets dying. The oceans are becoming ever more polluted and empty of fish.
So she turns to us, the adults and asks "What will be left for me and my children?
And face this if you wish to know Greta
WE have NO answer for her, we just chatter on like monkeys and maybe this makes her just a little crazy.
If so I would call that a divine madness
To think that this corrupt old world would ever listen to a child.
Well she has this going for her.
It is written that those who cannot be made to listen
must/will be made to feel."
Children grow up. The richest of men grow old.
Trust me Greta has yet come into her time When she does she will have an entire generation at her back.
"Beware when a man takes three steps back
he mat be preparing to make a great leap forward"
Greta is laying the foundations of all that is to come, of all that must come if Greta and her children are to survive.
And to be brutally honest here.
WE have no rights what so ever
We are rapists complaining that our victim is telling everyone of our crimes.
Dr Peterson points out that solar works poorly at night.
But over looks the possibility that WE might have to change to accommodate necessity.
He goes on to argue that as we can't predict consequences we should not act with regards to what we don't understand. but theirs a butt load we do understand and we do nothing..
Greta is doing what she has been called to do.
Reasonable people change to better suit the world
unreasonable people demand that the world change to suit them
therefore all real change is brought about by unreasonable people.
Greta just might save her world and the rest of us in the process. No telling what she will become before she's out of high school.
But over looks the possibility that WE might have to change to accommodate necessity.
He goes on to argue that as we can't predict consequences we should not act with regards to what we don't understand. but theirs a butt load we do understand and we do nothing..
Greta is doing what she has been called to do.
Reasonable people change to better suit the world
unreasonable people demand that the world change to suit them
therefore all real change is brought about by unreasonable people.
Greta just might save her world and the rest of us in the process. No telling what she will become before she's out of high school.
Jordan Peterson is undoubtedly intelligent and articulate. Within his field of expertise he is, quite literally, and expert. When it comes to matters of psychology and social interaction, I have no reason to question his assertions, and find many of his ideas to be both thought-provoking and useful.
However, Jordan makes the mistake of a lot of intelligent people who are acknowledged experts; he assumes his intelligence and expertise gives him some notion of how one might address problems outside his domain.
I don't fault him for that; we ALL make that mistake to one degree or another; as the saying goes "When you're a hammer, every problem looks like a nail" and we try to solve the problems we see with the tools we know, whether they are suited to the task or no.
HOWEVER, Jordan has a megaphone that allows him to shape opinion more than most, so he needs to be very VERY careful about the things he says when he is working outside his domain.
I fear he may not be as careful in this regard as he thinks he is.
With respect to Greta, I'm inclined to cut her some slack because she is (as you rightly point out) still a child and is still figuring out how things work in order to get things done.
I still must point out though, that simply complaining doesn't solve problems. Actions do. So far, I've not heard her demand answers to pointed questions, only repeat the litany of things that we all already know (whether we wish to admit them or not). However, I may have missed something.
And please, don't take this as me ragging on some child who is only pointing out what doesn't make sense to her. I'm not (or at least, I'm not trying to). To the extent that she IS still a child, she's doing all she really has the ability to, and a heckuvalot more than most.
Here's the thing about this next one I'm posting.
In almost all his interviews on the climate topic
He's talking to people who are expert in their fields but often in one way or another attempts are being made to silence them and to ignore their research.
If even half of what he in conjunction with other highly qualified scientist
and researchers are saying is true... Then I have been massively mislead for the last 15 years.
In almost all his interviews on the climate topic
He's talking to people who are expert in their fields but often in one way or another attempts are being made to silence them and to ignore their research.
If even half of what he in conjunction with other highly qualified scientist
and researchers are saying is true... Then I have been massively mislead for the last 15 years.
As I observed in another thread, Science is not immune to politics, however much we might wish it were so.
Before going on I'd like to freely confess I
'm more than a little taken by Greta. her inner certainty and resolve would impress me in one my own age, now far from young.
I see Greta as being akin to the boy whose thumb is stuck in the leaking dike. He knows this cannot stop the flood. If he goes the spread the alarm the hole will grow and many drown.
So thathere he must abide. He's done all he can, knows its
noww enough. He can shout and cry out but no help can h, ear him.
e
It is out of his hands. all that is left to him is to go to meet his fate with "Purity of heart"
(Purity of heart means to will one thing)... unceasingly.
He has given his life in sacrifice and only time will reveal weather his sacrifice will save many or all or if he merely to be the first to drown.
Greta is really all that gives me hope we will grow up in time to understand our real peril and come to her aid before the deluge.
Both caps are melting almost 4 times
faster than we thought. as of three days ago.
'm more than a little taken by Greta. her inner certainty and resolve would impress me in one my own age, now far from young.
I see Greta as being akin to the boy whose thumb is stuck in the leaking dike. He knows this cannot stop the flood. If he goes the spread the alarm the hole will grow and many drown.
So thathere he must abide. He's done all he can, knows its
noww enough. He can shout and cry out but no help can h, ear him.
e
It is out of his hands. all that is left to him is to go to meet his fate with "Purity of heart"
(Purity of heart means to will one thing)... unceasingly.
He has given his life in sacrifice and only time will reveal weather his sacrifice will save many or all or if he merely to be the first to drown.
Greta is really all that gives me hope we will grow up in time to understand our real peril and come to her aid before the deluge.
Both caps are melting almost 4 times
faster than we thought. as of three days ago.